So I’ve realized that in conversations I’ll use traditional terms for men as general terms for all genders, both singularly and for groups. I always mean it well, but I’ve been thinking that it’s not as inclusive to women/trans people.

For example I would say:

“What’s up guys?” “How’s it going man?” "Good job, my dude!” etc.

Replacing these terms with person, people, etc sounds awkward. Y’all works but sounds very southern US (nowhere near where I am located) so it sounds out of place.

So what are some better options?

Edit: thanks for all the answers peoples, I appreciate the honest ones and some of the funny ones.

The simplest approach is to just drop the usage of guys, man, etc. Folks for groups and mate for singular appeal to me when I do want to add one in between friends.

    • yngmnwntr@lemmy.ml
      0·
      10 months ago

      I say “greetings earthling(s)” but I also like gumshoe! Also definitely adding “listen up assholes” to the rotation, my coworkers appreciate your suggestions!

  • TGhost [She/Her]@lemmy.ml
    0·
    10 months ago

    Dude its OK for me because you Know, the dude.

    Pacifist as fuck, its a good name then. I don’t feel it like man, etc. Even the majority when using it don’t think about lebowski.

    If i name someone dude, there is more than “man” behind. But I’m maybe wrong ?

    • Cagi@lemmy.ca
      0·
      10 months ago

      Dude isn’t quite there yet. The phrase “I fuck dudes” has only one interpretation still.

      There are still lots of reasonable women who don’t want to be called dude as it is still associated with masculine people.

      • TGhost [She/Her]@lemmy.ml
        0·
        10 months ago

        Mistake ive edited. Bad reading at first. I’ve respond imgining me self speaking to a dude of me. Not at a group. Individually, no way I call a miss “dude”.

  • PM_me_trebuchets@lemm.ee
    0·
    10 months ago

    I’m AFAB enby, saying “you guys” and calling me “dude” is fine. Those to me aren’t gendered anymore. The people who get offended at general terms like these for groups of people need to touch grass.

    But if you’re dead set on it, embrace y’all lol. Just don’t say it with a southern drawl and you’ll be fine. It’s a fantastic gender neutral term. You can also just train yourself not to add in the “you guys” to the “what’s up” phrase, and maybe just say “what’s up with you?” “What’s up with you all?” Etc.

    • MajorMajormajormajor@lemmy.caOP
      0·
      10 months ago

      You can also just train yourself not to add in the “you guys” to the “what’s up” phrase, and maybe just say “what’s up with you?” “What’s up with you all?” Etc.

      This is likely the best solution, but also a hard one. Thanks for the perspective though.

    • cmbabul@lemmy.world
      0·
      10 months ago

      No southern drawl? Y’all is like our one positive contribution don’t take it away from those of us who ain’t bigots

    • lembas@lemm.ee
      0·
      10 months ago

      “Offended” is a bit of a strong word.

      Many trans folks are, understandably, bummed out when gendered terms that refer to their AGAB are used to refer to them.

      I don’t think there’s anything wrong with trying to avoid causing that brief moment of dysphoria. That just feels like a thoughtful and kind thing to do.

      • PM_me_trebuchets@lemm.ee
        0·
        10 months ago

        It’s good that OP means well, but also there are so many of us who do not care and are not affected because we know the speaker is using a generalized term and isn’t (usually) being malicious with it. I call several of my cisgender girl friends “dude” and “bro” and I’ll call men “girl” as a joke sometimes (like, girl what are you doing?). Many of these terms simply have completely lost their original gendered meaning in a lot of contexts.

        • 𝕱𝖎𝖗𝖊𝖜𝖎𝖙𝖈𝖍@lemmy.world
          0·
          10 months ago

          I’m also on Team “these words have lost their meaning” but personally feel the opposite way from OP.

          When people go out of their way to force inclusive language in a way that feels unnatural, and especially when I’m the only trans person in the room, it feels like I’m being singled out for my identity. I’m sure it’s being done with good intent but it makes me uncomfortable. It’s extra uncomfortable if they’re making (often incorrect) assumptions about my body in the process. I don’t need special language, the language already exists, I just want people to use it.

          That said, I won’t fault someone for trying to be inclusive and always respect other people’s language preferences. But too much can be just as uncomfortable as too little.

          (For context I’m 10 years MTF)

        • lembas@lemm.ee
          0·
          10 months ago

          That’s great, and it’s nice that you don’t have to deal with that jolt of dysphoria in those situations.

          I’m simply saying that it’s also common (and okay) to not be entirely comfortable with those terms. Especially from strangers or acquaintances.

          I don’t think seeking to reduce the linguistic pattern of male as the default is a misguided effort.

  • maxprime@lemmy.ml
    0·
    10 months ago

    A lot of people use “folks” for plural.

    I feel like “guys” is fairly un-gendered but people disagree with me. Personally, I haven’t used the word “guys” to refer to anything male in what seems like forever.

    “Bud” and “fella” are good singulars.

    • FlashMobOfOne@lemmy.world
      0·
      10 months ago

      “Guys” is ungendered.

      Reconsider whether it’s worth being friends that insist on fighting over the term “guys”.

      And if you are surrounded by a lot of particularly sensitive people, just call them “friend” or “friends”. It works for people you both like and dislike. Glorious.

    • TWeaK@lemm.eeEnglish
      0·
      10 months ago

      I used to have a maths teacher who called almost every number “guy”.

      “And this guy goes to zero, while this guy goes to infinity!”

    • unfnknblvbl@beehaw.org
      0·
      10 months ago

      I really, really wish we could degender “guy” and “guys”. I know plenty of people of all genders that use the words in general to describe people, objects, concepts, everything. The only holdouts are people that insist on it specifically meaning males. Ironically, these people are often the hardcore feminists.

      If other English words can change their meanings and be claimed/reclaimed by certain groups, why can’t others?

      Take guy! Use it to describe whatever you want! Free it of its historically phallic shackles!

      • fᵣₑfᵢ@lemmy.dbzer0.com
        0·
        10 months ago

        Yeah, I agree with you gal, while we’re at it I wish we could degender “gal”, “chick”, and “doll” too. Equality for all!

        • ShepherdPie@midwest.social
          0·
          10 months ago

          This sounds not to dissimilar to those who argued that legalizing gay marriage would lead to people marrying horses or their cars.

          • fᵣₑfᵢ@lemmy.dbzer0.com
            0·
            10 months ago

            How’s that? I’m not arguing against anything, I said I want more words to be disgendered

            How come people seem to only want words that were originally masculine coded words to be disgendered, but don’t want that for words that are originally feminine coded?

      • ready_for_qa@programming.dev
        0·
        9 months ago

        Guy was originally gender neutral as it was used to call someone stupidly bold (iirc). The term was most often used toward a single gender that was known for being stupidly bold and became synonymous with that gender. That’s how it became gendered.

    • MissJinx@lemmy.world
      0·
      10 months ago

      I’m a cis woman in IT, I’m guy, dude, man, bro… I don’t really care. You can change to make a specific person feel more confortable but most woman don’t care to be dude or guy

  • anarchost@lemm.ee
    0·
    10 months ago

    You’re asking about a collective and also a singular…

    Just in general I’d say that if you’re trying to quit a habit around trans women, go the extra mile and quit it around cis ones too. For the collective “hey guys” I have no one-word replacement (“folks/folx” sounds equally southern and somehow more cringe), but you could replace the whole phrase with “hey everybody”, “hi gang”, “how are you all”, or just “hey”.

    When speaking to any woman, I would advise against calling them “dude” or “man.” Full stop. No further thoughts necessary on that one.

    • MajorMajormajormajor@lemmy.caOP
      0·
      10 months ago

      Just in general I’d say that if you’re trying to quit a habit around trans women, go the extra mile and quit it around cis ones too.

      Sorry if it wasn’t clear enough, I’m looking for general terms to use for all people, regardless of their gender, not just trans people.

      There have been some good examples for groups, but nothing that fits well for talking to one person directly.

      • anarchost@lemm.ee
        0·
        10 months ago

        My personal recommendation is to drop the extra title entirely. For everybody.

        E.g. instead of saying “great work man” just say “great work.” It could help you prevent flubs later.

        I do wish I knew some non-binary singular terms I could use, but none come to my mind

          • anarchost@lemm.ee
            0·
            10 months ago

            I think I’m going to piggyback off inspiration of your question and ask my own, something like: “Enbies, how do you prefer partners or others refer to/about you?”

            BTW, sorry for misunderstanding the goal of your post, but I appreciate your (and others’) replies here.

    • PipedLinkBot@feddit.rocksBEnglish
      0·
      10 months ago

      Here is an alternative Piped link(s):

      Dude

      Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.

      I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.

  • TheAlbatross@lemmy.blahaj.zone
    0·
    10 months ago

    English is sorely lacking a second person plural. Y’all fills that gap well and should be adopted over other regional suggestions such as the Jersey youse guys or the dreaded Philly… yinz.

    I’d avoid using “dude” as I’ve heard this specifically as an example that bothered some women.

    Y’all is great. I use it often in the North East and only one schmuck ever said anything about it.

    Buddy works, but comes off kind of aggressive towards strangers, same with pal or pals, but that may be my own regional affectation showing off.

        • TheAlbatross@lemmy.blahaj.zone
          0·
          10 months ago

          People sometimes say that English is easier to learn than Mandarin because the latter has a lot of intonation specific meaning, but there’s a very clear difference between “Hey, buddy!” (jocular) that you say to a long loved friend and the “Hey, buddy!” (pejorative) you say to the guy who steals your grocery cart.