@PowerCrazy@return2ozma I like where you are heading. Probably better to define being able to see a set of targets around the vehicle. Easier to define, harder to game.
I wouldn’t ban cameras, but I would require the visibility be obtained without them. Cameras can give vision that is useful and implausible without them.
I wouldn’t ban cameras, but I would require the visibility be obtained without them. Cameras can give vision that is useful and implausible without them.
Yea this is probably the better play. But too often with modern cars they use the existence of the camera’s to make the sight lines impossibly dangerous (the infamous front facing camera on the f150 for example).
But that also mean truck can’t electrify. Tesla Model 3 weight around 3500lbs, a Ford F150 Lightning weight 6500lbs. That’s mean a “small” pickup truck like Nissan Navara/Frontier, which weight around 3500lbs, when turned into electric vehicle it will be around 4900lbs. A toyota Hilux 1998 also weight around 3600lbs.
Off-road vehicles don’t need to be registered or conform to any safety standards so if you are designing something for off-road use, none of this stuff matters, you just can’t ALSO drive it on-road.
I get the hate on trucks because they’ve become a luxury item/status symbol instead of a vehicle used for its utility. Arbitrary weight limits are probably not the best way to handle it though. Cars are heavier than I think you realize. Safety requirements and other government mandates have driven the average vehicle weight up over time too.
Every mini van on the market is over 4000 some pushing 5000. Most mid-sized sedans are over 3500 and probably all full sized. Mazda 3 is a compact sedan and tops out at ~3400. My mother’s 2019 Lincoln Continental is admittedly on the larger side and weighs in at ~4500 and the entire car is under 5 feet tall. Doing a quick search on a 2024 Tesla model 3 is 3862-4054 pounds. Ram Promaster 1500(think plumber van) start at about 4500 and go up. That doesn’t account for all the stuff those ultimately end up holding too. The sight lines in front of you on those vans are impeccable though.
Cars didn’t used to weigh that much and the safety regulations can still exist, it just requires car manufactures to fix their safety issues without adding more weight ultimately making everyone less safe.
A 90’s Ranger didn’t even have airbags let alone side curtain airbags. One of my 2012 cars had seven airbags just for the driver. Also ridiculous stuff like backup cameras being mandatory since May 1, 2018 which is why every car has a screen in it now. All that stuff has just been slowly adding weight a bit at a time.
NHTSA keeps changing/adding crash tests. So if manufacturers want to keep those 5 star ratings then they need to reinforce or redesign the chassis to obtain it which can add a non trivial amount of weight as well.
One of my vehicles they welded in ‘crash bars’ in front of and behind the front tires to improve its crash testing.
I’m of the opinion that vehicle registration should be by mass. I think that adding extra for use case and for expected hauling is also reasonable. We can allow the gas tax to slowly fade into a carbon tax while making registration be both the way we fund roads and a progressive tax on those who do more damage to them. We can even have different vehicle categories with different weight costs for incentives.
If there isn’t a weight limit, nothing else matters. Limit truck to <3500lbs, ban cameras and require ~130 degree unobstructed view for all mirrors.
Ban cameras? Like, back up cameras?
@PowerCrazy @return2ozma I like where you are heading. Probably better to define being able to see a set of targets around the vehicle. Easier to define, harder to game.
I wouldn’t ban cameras, but I would require the visibility be obtained without them. Cameras can give vision that is useful and implausible without them.
Yea this is probably the better play. But too often with modern cars they use the existence of the camera’s to make the sight lines impossibly dangerous (the infamous front facing camera on the f150 for example).
But that also mean truck can’t electrify. Tesla Model 3 weight around 3500lbs, a Ford F150 Lightning weight 6500lbs. That’s mean a “small” pickup truck like Nissan Navara/Frontier, which weight around 3500lbs, when turned into electric vehicle it will be around 4900lbs. A toyota Hilux 1998 also weight around 3600lbs.
It can electrify, it just can’t be carrying around batteries that will give it 300miles of range. A ford Ranger from 1990 weighs <3000lbs.
Yeah, but it would be pointless without the range considering these thing are made for off-road.
“Pointless” god I wish we lived in that society.
Off-road vehicles don’t need to be registered or conform to any safety standards so if you are designing something for off-road use, none of this stuff matters, you just can’t ALSO drive it on-road.
I get the hate on trucks because they’ve become a luxury item/status symbol instead of a vehicle used for its utility. Arbitrary weight limits are probably not the best way to handle it though. Cars are heavier than I think you realize. Safety requirements and other government mandates have driven the average vehicle weight up over time too.
Every mini van on the market is over 4000 some pushing 5000. Most mid-sized sedans are over 3500 and probably all full sized. Mazda 3 is a compact sedan and tops out at ~3400. My mother’s 2019 Lincoln Continental is admittedly on the larger side and weighs in at ~4500 and the entire car is under 5 feet tall. Doing a quick search on a 2024 Tesla model 3 is 3862-4054 pounds. Ram Promaster 1500(think plumber van) start at about 4500 and go up. That doesn’t account for all the stuff those ultimately end up holding too. The sight lines in front of you on those vans are impeccable though.
Cars didn’t used to weigh that much and the safety regulations can still exist, it just requires car manufactures to fix their safety issues without adding more weight ultimately making everyone less safe.
A 1990 Ford Ranger weighed <3000 lbs.
A 90’s Ranger didn’t even have airbags let alone side curtain airbags. One of my 2012 cars had seven airbags just for the driver. Also ridiculous stuff like backup cameras being mandatory since May 1, 2018 which is why every car has a screen in it now. All that stuff has just been slowly adding weight a bit at a time.
NHTSA keeps changing/adding crash tests. So if manufacturers want to keep those 5 star ratings then they need to reinforce or redesign the chassis to obtain it which can add a non trivial amount of weight as well.
One of my vehicles they welded in ‘crash bars’ in front of and behind the front tires to improve its crash testing.
I’m of the opinion that vehicle registration should be by mass. I think that adding extra for use case and for expected hauling is also reasonable. We can allow the gas tax to slowly fade into a carbon tax while making registration be both the way we fund roads and a progressive tax on those who do more damage to them. We can even have different vehicle categories with different weight costs for incentives.