I didn’t want to relay this while the thread was still so hot, but I’m a large scary-guy-shaped person - I really doubt any of the guys in this thread would say any of this to my face - and I didn’t understand this until my sister asked me to tell our dad something she needed him to hear because “he’ll listen to you because you’re a man”. I said I didn’t think he was that sort of person, and she just said, “No, it’s normal for people not to listen to women.” So I told him the thing and he listened to me where he hadn’t listened to her.
I was pretty shook by that, so I asked my partner if that was normal and she said “Oh, yeah,” without having to think twice about it.
That’s where my journey started. After you start seeing it, you can’t stop.
I also started noticing at a certain point how often women would randomly apologise for existing near me in public. Like they are clearly afraid of me. It doesn’t feel nice, but it’s never once occurred to me to yell “not all men!” or “I’m one of the good ones!” at their retreating backs.
I’ve discovered - through being NB - that I can completely reverse this by even slightly feminising my appearance. I actually get random women smiling at me in public, not politely, but openly and genuinely. It makes me think of what a trans man said about how lonely it is to be a man, how he misses the camraderie of women looking out for each other. From my perspective when I’m fully man-coded I agree, men absolutely do not openly smile at me. That’s too gay, or something.
I’m not worried that any bad actors will abuse this info to get women to let their guard down though, because a consequence of this is getting an absolutely appalling amount of disgust and hate from random dudes, but I consider the trade absolutely worth it when I have the energy for it.
Thanks for sharing your story. One of my guy friends is the Hagrid Type. Big, hairy, loud. But he also tries to break through his appearance. And I think that’s the whole point:
Instead of telling “not all men” it’s better (but also more difficult) to show us. Be nice. Hold other men accountable. Things can be changed but first we have to face reality.
It also saddens me to hear about the manly loneliness that’s caused by the same internalized sexism. I’m glad to hear you found a way out of this, that still lets you be you!
I didn’t want to relay this while the thread was still so hot, but I’m a large scary-guy-shaped person - I really doubt any of the guys in this thread would say any of this to my face - and I didn’t understand this until my sister asked me to tell our dad something she needed him to hear because “he’ll listen to you because you’re a man”. I said I didn’t think he was that sort of person, and she just said, “No, it’s normal for people not to listen to women.” So I told him the thing and he listened to me where he hadn’t listened to her.
I was pretty shook by that, so I asked my partner if that was normal and she said “Oh, yeah,” without having to think twice about it.
That’s where my journey started. After you start seeing it, you can’t stop.
I also started noticing at a certain point how often women would randomly apologise for existing near me in public. Like they are clearly afraid of me. It doesn’t feel nice, but it’s never once occurred to me to yell “not all men!” or “I’m one of the good ones!” at their retreating backs.
I’ve discovered - through being NB - that I can completely reverse this by even slightly feminising my appearance. I actually get random women smiling at me in public, not politely, but openly and genuinely. It makes me think of what a trans man said about how lonely it is to be a man, how he misses the camraderie of women looking out for each other. From my perspective when I’m fully man-coded I agree, men absolutely do not openly smile at me. That’s too gay, or something.
I’m not worried that any bad actors will abuse this info to get women to let their guard down though, because a consequence of this is getting an absolutely appalling amount of disgust and hate from random dudes, but I consider the trade absolutely worth it when I have the energy for it.
Thanks for sharing your story. One of my guy friends is the Hagrid Type. Big, hairy, loud. But he also tries to break through his appearance. And I think that’s the whole point:
Instead of telling “not all men” it’s better (but also more difficult) to show us. Be nice. Hold other men accountable. Things can be changed but first we have to face reality.
It also saddens me to hear about the manly loneliness that’s caused by the same internalized sexism. I’m glad to hear you found a way out of this, that still lets you be you!