Nearly every machine with any complexity greater than a light switch comes with a manual. As the number of features of a system grows, it becomes less and less feasible to design user interfaces that expose all of those features so intuitively that most people get them instantly. In fact large software with tons of features in UI have manuals and need books to master. Featurefull software requires documentation. And so the question isn’t whether one piece of software requires documentation to use or not, instead it’s whether that pieces of software can do more or less, and whether someone bothered to write a doc. In Linux’es case someone typically bothered to do it. There is an M to RTF. On Windows on the other hand, if something obvious doesn’t work, or it isn’t obvious, you’re often stuck with hearsay or worse - banging your head against the wall. It’s quite alright for people to prefer to stick with what they know whether it provides the easiest way to do something or not. But let’s not get confused that RTFM is a bad thing. RTFM means there’s an M, it means the M will help, it means that the software has the capability you need, and likely more than you need. ☺️
Okay. But did any of these users need to read the manual to use Windows? My point was not that RTFM is a bad thing per se, but that pretending people aren’t proper Linux users if they don’t is absurd. They have Linux in their machine? They’re Linux users.
You’ll find that most users don’t really use Windows. They use a handful of programs, usually superficially, and that’s pretty much it. People tend to have as little knowledge of anything computer related as possible. Whether they actually need it or not. Knowing about computers is seen as “bad”.
If you ever have to support users, it’s very enlightening in that regard.
Which was exactly my point. Most people see their computer/OS as the thing that lets them log in and launch their programs, that’s all. Which comes back to expecting most people that launch Linux to do it being an unreasonable ask. We don’t ask people to be specialists of their cars’ mechanics to drive it.
I’ve helped plenty of non-technical folks install Linux on older machines and they have zero problems using it for basic computing stuff, especially since so much of it is just websites.
I’ve also helped plenty of technical folks install Linux on newer hardware, and some had difficulties and I had to provide support more than once. One of my grandparents understood Ubuntu/Unity immediately, the other had trouble. Anecdotes don’t say much.
If we want to keep going with car comparisons, I’ll try to make it illustrate my point once again - do those people happen to learn that R doesn’t mean “Really fast” by being snarkily told to RTFM by a car enthusiast or they aren’t a real driver?
I was specifically addressing the “Linux users need to RTFM or they aren’t Linux users” affirmation. It’s not defending ignorance to point out that it’s gatekeepey as hell.
Nearly every machine with any complexity greater than a light switch comes with a manual. As the number of features of a system grows, it becomes less and less feasible to design user interfaces that expose all of those features so intuitively that most people get them instantly. In fact large software with tons of features in UI have manuals and need books to master. Featurefull software requires documentation. And so the question isn’t whether one piece of software requires documentation to use or not, instead it’s whether that pieces of software can do more or less, and whether someone bothered to write a doc. In Linux’es case someone typically bothered to do it. There is an M to RTF. On Windows on the other hand, if something obvious doesn’t work, or it isn’t obvious, you’re often stuck with hearsay or worse - banging your head against the wall. It’s quite alright for people to prefer to stick with what they know whether it provides the easiest way to do something or not. But let’s not get confused that RTFM is a bad thing. RTFM means there’s an M, it means the M will help, it means that the software has the capability you need, and likely more than you need. ☺️
Okay. But did any of these users need to read the manual to use Windows? My point was not that RTFM is a bad thing per se, but that pretending people aren’t proper Linux users if they don’t is absurd. They have Linux in their machine? They’re Linux users.
You’ll find that most users don’t really use Windows. They use a handful of programs, usually superficially, and that’s pretty much it. People tend to have as little knowledge of anything computer related as possible. Whether they actually need it or not. Knowing about computers is seen as “bad”.
If you ever have to support users, it’s very enlightening in that regard.
Which was exactly my point. Most people see their computer/OS as the thing that lets them log in and launch their programs, that’s all. Which comes back to expecting most people that launch Linux to do it being an unreasonable ask. We don’t ask people to be specialists of their cars’ mechanics to drive it.
I’ve helped plenty of non-technical folks install Linux on older machines and they have zero problems using it for basic computing stuff, especially since so much of it is just websites.
I’ve also helped plenty of technical folks install Linux on newer hardware, and some had difficulties and I had to provide support more than once. One of my grandparents understood Ubuntu/Unity immediately, the other had trouble. Anecdotes don’t say much.
Yea but we expect them to also know “R” isn’t for “Really fast”.
You need to recognize what defending ignorance is.
If we want to keep going with car comparisons, I’ll try to make it illustrate my point once again - do those people happen to learn that R doesn’t mean “Really fast” by being snarkily told to RTFM by a car enthusiast or they aren’t a real driver?
I was specifically addressing the “Linux users need to RTFM or they aren’t Linux users” affirmation. It’s not defending ignorance to point out that it’s gatekeepey as hell.
Yes of course a Linux user is a Linux user whether they RTFM or not.