• Noble Shift@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    Conservatives & (Abrahamic) Religion. Both of which without the world would be a better place.

    Also, as always, powered by hate, ignorance and GREED.

    • Asidonhopo@lemmy.world
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      10 months ago

      Are the Dharmic faiths particularly inclusive of queer folks? Or just by comparison? I don’t know about Buddhism but China is somewhat antigay, and it’s not like the Kama Sutra had any gay stuff in it, and with all the erotic Hindu temple art I’ve never seen any gay stuff going on. Happy to be corrected if I’m wrong in my amateur assessment here

      • OBJECTION!@lemmy.ml
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        10 months ago

        I can’t speak for Hinduism, but this Wikipedia article goes into some of the history of Buddhism in regards to sexuality. Generally, sex of all kinds, whether heterosexual or homosexual or sex with celestial beings, was seen as another one of the 10,000 things that could distract one from the path - but otherwise there was nothing particularly immoral about it. Monks and nuns generally had to follow rules that prohibited both, in order to remove distractions, but those rules were never meant for the general public, aside from the precept against the “misuse” of sexuality, which is ambiguous but thought to refer more to things like SA.

        When we’re talking about modern China, or the present day state of other historically Buddhist countries, it would be reductive to say that their current attitudes towards homosexuality are a product of religion, because it ignores more recent events and currents, and other historical factors. China was also historically influenced by Confucianism, which was more homophobic, but it was also influenced by a bunch of other philosophies, and today it’s not very religious at all. Japan was historically very gay, and the 11th century Tale of Genji has a bisexual protagonist fucking everybody.

        However, every historical tradition had to adapt to contact with the West during the age of colonialism. China at first tried hard to cling to its traditions and stubbornly refuse to adapt to new, Western ideas, but the “century of humiliation” happened and they realized they had to adapt or die. Japan was not directly colonized, but they still had a massive revamping of their society with all these new ideas coming in. Every country in Asia has a story like that. And then you have another 100 years of stuff happening after that.

        China’s modern day homophobia does not come from a place of “The Buddha said this was bad,” rather, it comes from seeing homosexuality as a Western invention, and a symptom of “bourgeois decadence.” Sadly, such brainworms are common in many socialist countries. There is a stereotype many people have that gay people all live in cities and spend all our time partying at nightclubs, because that makes for better TV than the reality does. Ironically, there are many countries in the world that once had their own more tolerant traditions that were replaced with Western values during colonialism, who now hold those values up as their own against more progressive, modern day Western values.

      • Noble Shift@lemmy.world
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        10 months ago

        You know my friend, I am just starting this journey, and I haven’t got there yet, so I have no answers for you. TBH I don’t think I want to learn about anymore than the handful that I do. So far they all have positives to add to a life well lived but taken as a whole they don’t make sense. Or they are just plain ol straight fucked up.

        So don’t wait for me on your journey…

  • GlendatheGayWitch@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    The US isn’t any more concerned about sexual orientation now than any point in the past. Back in colonial times, it wouldn’t have been safe to be anything other than straight with all the hyper religious colonists. They were even forcing their gender conformity and the straight sexual orientation on the Native Americans. Baron Friedrich von Steuben got a pass for being gay, probably because he was the one in charge of training the troops for Washington. 100 years ago, you could be killed on the street for being anything other than straight or denied jobs. The Lavender scare of the mid century brought this more to light. The AIDS crisis that started in the 80s and bled through into the 90s and 2000s as new medicines were being invented, further brought negative light to sexual orientations outside of straight. The cause of all of this attention to sexual orientation has been the religions brought over by colonists.

    In recent years, sexual orientations outside of straight are finally being seen in a positive light with Lawrence v TX (2003) legalizing same-sex relationships and Hodges v Obergefell (2015) legalizing same-sex marriages. In Bostock v Clayton County (2020) legal protections against job discrimination based on sexual orientation and gender identity were finally put into place over 70 years after the start of the Lavender Scare.

    The attention to sexual orientation has always been part of North American history. It has just changed from acceptance with the Native American peoples to hate, death, and intolerance under the colonists, to a more accepting present day. With some of the positive news in recent years, it can be easy to forget (if you’re surrounded by progressives in a blue state) that the hate of sexuality injected into North America in the 15th Century still has hold over large portions of the population today.

  • TheDeadHorse@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    There are 8 billion people in the world. If 10,000 people on Xwitter are upset about something, it’s statistically insignificant.

    • dependencyinjection@discuss.tchncs.de
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      10 months ago

      This is what pisses me off about people that go on about I’m sick of this woke society or sick of these “crazy trans people”, or whatever else.

      And I’m like brother I do not care and most people do not care. Let people do what they want it ain’t that deep. I’m off the view if it doesn’t negatively affect me then what business is it of mine how people live their life. The things they get outraged over is just from some minority of loons on Twitter and not everybody.

  • Nytefyre@kbin.melroy.org
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    10 months ago

    Because the bigots seemed to have found ways to get in positions of influence to spread their toxic ideologies and get laws passed that targets their ‘enemies’. Even when the Supreme Court ruled in 2015 that same-sex marriage is legal, I knew in the back of my mind that things are far from over. Because after that? Like one month later, Kim Davis denied legalizing a same-sex marriage.

    And things seemed to have worsened thanks to the existence of people like DeSantis, Trump and any GOP still somehow breathing that wants to antagonize everyone over sexual orientation. Because in their psychotic structure, they want America to be purely Christian, purely White and probably Blonde, Blue-eyed and fair skinned.

    Even in 2004, George W Bush back then on February was quoted to have said: “Our Nation must defend the sanctity of marriage”. What he means is, to protect the sanctity of STRAIGHT marriage because he seems to have it in his head that marriage is the property of the church and all that shit.

    Doesn’t that sound exactly like the kind of people a certain country named Germany aspired to be like back in WWII? Ironic.

  • TechNerdWizard42@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    Because Americans are too ignorant and uneducated to assemble tribally over any actually important issue. Heck most people on Lemmy think if you’re gay and go to UAE they just chop your head off and bury you under a camel. The reality is that the world doesn’t care, just keep your private life private. But when your entire identity becomes a label you have to shout at everyone it’s basically veganism

    • dependencyinjection@discuss.tchncs.de
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      10 months ago

      I don’t think it’s good to just generalise a whole country of people. I’m not American but I realise we only really see the lunatics and crazy opinions. The regular people are as boring and uninterested as the rest of us, it’s just that doesn’t drive engagement.

    • slst@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      10 months ago

      “Keep your private life private” Okay so I can’t hold my gf’s hand in the street but if I had a bf it would be allowed. In some countries I wouldn’t be allowed to marry her. Are those issues of making my private life public? A lot of people do care and hate us. Im getting weird looks everytime I’m with her in the street. So shut up about issues you’re not concerned with.

      • TechNerdWizard42@lemmy.world
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        10 months ago

        That’s not true at all. You have a warped view of the reality because of being fed negative propaganda.

        The same way the North Koreans believe weird untrue things. You can see that propaganda because it’s transparent to anyone who has lived outside that bubble. The American propaganda is equally stupid

  • Feathercrown@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    It’s finally reaching such widespread acceptance that 1. Actual bigots are getting concerned they can’t be bad people anymore and 2. Assorted people are getting tired of the discourse.

  • bizarroland@fedia.io
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    10 months ago

    Aside from what everyone else has said, one of the big leaders to this scenario is that the world has gotten so much safer and so much less violent and so much more accepting that people have to literally scrape the barrels to find something to be outraged about.

    We all of us know that the Republican playbook of taking rights away from people is a thing that is intended to target people and punish them for not adhering to the moral code of the people doing the targeting.

    But the fact that we can spend so much of our national resources on arguing over morality is a side effect of the world being so good that we don’t have to argue over worse things.

    I’m not attempting to apologize or forgive anybody for their stance, but it is true that we are arguing over whether or not it’s okay to have an abortion or whether or not it’s okay to be gay rather than whether it’s not okay to let have the country starve to death or whether or not it’s okay to kill everyone all the time always.

    I’ve said this before and I will inevitably say it again, human history is a pus filled boil on our consciences.

    The only way to fix it is to lance it and to deal with all of the pus. We are in the pus clean up stage of human history, and in time with enough constant patient care, it will get better.

    • Don_Dickle@lemmy.worldOP
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      10 months ago

      Well in america it seems to seems that people are theologically do things against LGBTQ and enacting them. The news we get and i preface this while knowing America is on the brink of it. That other countries or instutions are savages. Not my opinion but what we see daily.

      • Dae@pawb.social
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        10 months ago

        My guy, there are entire countries controlled by Islamic Extremists where you’re lucky if all they do is kill you when they find out you’re LGBT, and it’s entirely for “theological reasons.”

        I put this in quotes, because I’m not nor have I ever been a Muslim. But Islamic Extremists will kill gay people for supposed “theological reasons.”

        It’s most definitely not just America doing it because “mah holy book says it’s wrong.”

        • Don_Dickle@lemmy.worldOP
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          10 months ago

          Like I said I am in America and all we see is how backwards other countries are on the topic. It just feels like America is now in the process of becoming one of them

      • Lem Jukes@lemm.ee
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        10 months ago

        Right, fuck, my bad. Welp, yeah, I’m sorry to say but I think it has more to do with your progression into understanding more about the world and perspectives outside of your own experience. In no way am I trying to be mean or discouraging. You asked a really valid and important question, and i guess i impulsively reacted and forgot there are people less jaded than me. For what it’s worth i admire you and hope that learning some people are STILL stuck being shitty doesn’t make you think everyone sucks. And I’m proud to learn that another person younger than me just ‘gets it’ that people are people deserving of love and respect regardless of bullshit like who they themselves love.

    • NostraDavid@programming.dev
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      10 months ago

      The prosecutor argued that the murder of Shepard was premeditated and driven by greed

      McKinney’s girlfriend told police that he had been motivated by anti-gay sentiment but later recanted her statement, saying that she had lied because she thought it would help him.

      Price said she had lied to police about McKinney having been provoked by an unwanted sexual advance from Shepard, telling TV journalist Elizabeth Vargas, “I don’t think it was a hate crime at all.”[9][37] Rerucha said, “It was a murder that was once again driven by drugs.”[9]

      Doesn’t seem to be a hatecrime. Just a crime against someone that happened to be gay.

    • Don_Dickle@lemmy.worldOP
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      10 months ago

      yea yea saw the movie. It just kind of seems today more blatant then ever before. And on my off days I am usually on weed and alcohol. While I search for a new state to be stationed at.

    • Etterra@lemmy.world
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      10 months ago

      Well to be fair a lot of those politicians aren’t in the 1%, they just want to be. And they’re more than happy to toe the party line and step on everyone they can in order to get to the top. And then there’s the true believers, but let’s be honest anybody who’s a true believer or anything is crazy.

  • Showroom7561@lemmy.ca
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    10 months ago

    Because social media amplifies and incentives minority, hateful views to make it seem like everyone is concerned about these things.

    The reality is, it’s the same small group of hateful idiots who are always in the spotlight.

    In real life, even in small towns, people either don’t care or they celebrate how far we’ve come as a society.

  • southsamurai@sh.itjust.works
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    10 months ago

    You’ve gotten enough good answers that I think it okay to address a tangent.

    Things are definitely at the point where christofascists, and other hate driven ideologies are getting louder.

    But, and this is vitally important as to why the pushback is making it a matter of public discourse at the level you’re asking about, there’s more allies now than ever.

    Be ready for old man talking here, and ignore if not interested. Disclaimer: I have arthritis, and it’s easier to type gay than LGBTQ, so I’ll be using the shorter word for that reason, not as an exclusion.

    Back in the seventies and eighties, gay rights was a thing for mostly gay people. Before that it had been gaining minor support, and the eighties were when social restrictions started changing enough that gay people were allowed to have some degree of public awareness in both news and fiction.

    I keep bringing it up in various places, but Billy Crystal played the first recurring openly gay character on television. That was in 1977, and ran until 1981. I don’t think it can be said enough how huge that was in bringing awareness of gay people as just people was. That role brought gay into our homes and lives in a way nothing had before.

    When something makes a group real to the majority, makes things stop being a dirty secret and just another part of life, you get kids growing up that are more open and accepting. As acceptance grew, so did the amount of people coming out.

    As people came out, the straights realized that not only had they always known gay people, but they liked them, and even loved them for years, sometimes a lifetime. When that starts spreading, you have more people that are willing to support gay people and their rights as fellow humans.

    Instead of being pariahs, gay people became part of life, part of our hearts. Eventually, more and more people that didn’t have direct relationships with someone gay became allies, supporters.

    However, the more gay people became a part of life, the more noise bigots made, in their own homes and in public. So, instead of it being a dirty little secret nobody talked about, that way of thinking got nastier and louder. Before, it wasn’t something everyone would even know about until much later in life, but as the gay rights movement in the seventies started building up steam, you had more hatred being spewed as well. There had been before, but it was more likely to be handled with dismissive or contemptuous remarks rather than outright venom and bile in the open.

    Now, us folks that were kids during the late 70s and early 80s didn’t just accept gay folks. We would often defy elders that opposed gay rights or bad talked them. As time passed and we grew up, the segment of that generation that became allies tended to be more and more vocal in our support. By the nineties, my generation was moving into adulthood and willing to vote our conscience. We were willing to put our time and money into the cause. Sometimes, we’d put our bodies on the line when things got ugly.

    Move forward to now, and you’ve got two or three generations actively and loudly opposing the bigots, and not just the gay people. The bigots are smaller in number, but have been pandered to by political groups around the world, so have more weight than their numbers should give them.

    Mind you, the bigots also include people of every generation too. Don’t imagine that there aren’t kids even that spew the same kind of nastiness that’s been used since before the 70s. But there’s more in direct opposition to them, and plenty of passive dismissal of the bigotry. Bigotry is not a relic of the past, nor is it limited to older generations; some of the loudest and most obnoxious hatred gets spewed by younger adherents. But the seeming percentage of hate is lower in younger generations, and the seeming percentage of outright support is higher.

    That puts us in the situation we’re in, where hate has a bigger voice than it should, and love/acceptance has to shout louder to oppose it.

    • Track_Shovel@slrpnk.net
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      10 months ago

      Hey.

      I really enjoyed your comment. It’s very well written. Nice job. That’s it; that’s all.

    • tetris11@lemmy.ml
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      10 months ago

      it really feels like it’s at a boiling point though right now. World governments have all shifted more to the right on average than they have in the last 80 years.

      • ganymede@lemmy.ml
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        10 months ago

        governments have all shifted more to the right on average

        it appears to be the case. though afaict none of it appears to be organic.

      • MonkeMischief@lemmy.today
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        10 months ago

        There’s been some surprising upsets recently though! We were all bracing for a fashy-wave but lots of progressive leaders have been elected lately, after it looked like their hardline iron-fist nationlist counterparts were gaining ground.

        By no means a reason to take it easy and give them a breather, oh no! But we should definitely acknowledge every little bit of dystopia we manage to collectively avert. Even if only a little.

        • eldavi@lemmy.ml
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          10 months ago

          the fashy-waves were manifested by centrists leaders that we learned were very fashy-friendly after those upsets made those leaders intrigue with the far right; as is happening in france with macron; or clinging on to conservative policies; as is happening in the uk with starmer.

          the people voted left; but all of the leaders went right anyways.

          harris and trump are doing something similar with harris ignoring the will of 68% of americans when with comes to the genocide and trump with project 2025.

      • TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world
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        10 months ago

        Because the right offers people stability, authority, etc. People like that.

        They don’t like left because it’s too vague and complicated to understand their points of view.

        Trans people = bad is a lot easier for the average person to understand, than explaining to them what a transsexual person is and isn’t, and the various types of trans/queer identities. That shit requires a dictionary of trans terminology and hours of time to understand.

    • some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org
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      10 months ago

      Things are definitely at the point where christofascists, and other hate driven ideologies are getting louder.

      Good time to bring up how their numbers are drastically thinning. This is a big win and part of why we need to fight them hard as their fear of marginalization causes them to switch from dirty tactics to outright fascism to cling to power.

      Survey: White Christianity is declining while the religiously unaffiliated keep growing

      • TubularTittyFrog@lemmy.world
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        10 months ago

        they are popular because they provide simple answers to complex issues.

        People like that. Esp younger folks.

        Just like the alt right is so popular with them, because it gives them simple answers.

        Left doesn’t have simple answers. Wants you to listen to a college course type of lecture on every issue… people don’t care about that. They want a simple soundbyte they can emotionally respond to. Left is very poor at that… there are some examples, but they dont’ really get much traction outside of leftist/socialist circles.

        • VirtualOdour@sh.itjust.works
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          10 months ago

          Also you can spend thirty seconds as a right winger and have them all tell you that you’re great, important, clever, worthwhile, and all those things – spend twenty years dedicating your adult life to leftwing values and you’ll still get spat on by your political peers because your opinion on some obscure issue is 2% different to theirs.

      • octopus_ink@lemmy.ml
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        10 months ago

        That bump in 2020 is kind of interesting. The reason seems obvious, but correlation does not equal causation and all that. It does make me wonder if a big chunk of people claiming to be unaffilated are doing so because they think it’s the correct answer to give, not because it’s actually true. (My theory being that the pandemic made them decide they better stop denying Jesus for awhile or whatever)

        • fruitycoder@sh.itjust.works
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          10 months ago

          Religion is an opiate. The best way to reduce its abuse is by addressing the underlying pain. When people conditions get worse they look to things to help numb the pain.

    • Tar_Alcaran@sh.itjust.works
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      10 months ago

      A little late-80s perspective: when I was growing up, “gay” was an insult we’d call eachother jokingly. Nobody “was gay” because that’s a (light, funny) slur. Hell, it wasn’t till I was 28 I realized it didn’t “have a dating-girls phase” that I never grew out of, I was just bi.

      The homophobia is still pretty deeply ingrained even in people who aren’t that old and are really trying. I can only imagine how bad it is for those who aren’t and don’t.

  • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
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    10 months ago

    Michael Parenti addresses this well:

    Class gets its significance from the process of surplus extraction. The relationship between worker and owner is essentially an exploita­tive one, involving the constant transfer of wealth from those who labor (but do not own) to those who own (but do not labor). This is how some people get richer and richer without working, or with doing only a fraction of the work that enriches them, while others toil hard for an entire lifetime only to end up with little or nothing.

    Those who occupy the higher circles of wealth and power are keenly aware of their own interests. While they sometimes seriously differ among themselves on specific issues, they exhibit an impres­sive cohesion when it comes to protecting the existing class system of corporate power, property, privilege, and profit. At the same time, they are careful to discourage public awareness of the class power they wield. They avoid the C-word, especially when used in reference to themselves as in "owning class;’ "upper class;’ or “moneyed class.” And they like it least when the politically active elements of the owning class are called the “ruling class.” The ruling class in this country has labored long to leave the impression that it does not exist, does not own the lion’s share of just about everything, and does not exercise a vastly disproportionate influence over the affairs of the nation. Such precautions are them­selves symptomatic of an acute awareness of class interests.

    Yet ruling class members are far from invisible. Their command positions in the corporate world, their control of international finance and industry, their ownership of the major media, and their influence over state power and the political process are all matters of public record- to some limited degree. While it would seem a sim­ple matter to apply the C-word to those who occupy the highest reaches of the C-world, the dominant class ideology dismisses any such application as a lapse into “conspiracy theory.” The C-word is also taboo when applied to the millions who do the work of society for what are usually niggardly wages, the “working class,” a term that is dismissed as Marxist jargon. And it is verboten to refer to the "exploiting and exploited classes;’ for then one is talk­ing about the very essence of the capitalist system, the accumulation of corporate wealth at the expense of labor.

    The C-word is an acceptable term when prefaced with the sooth­ing adjective “middle.” Every politician, publicist, and pundit will rhapsodize about the middle class, the object of their heartfelt con­cern. The much admired and much pitied middle class is supposedly inhabited by virtuously self-sufficient people, free from the presumed profligacy of those who inhabit the lower rungs of soci­ety. By including almost everyone, “middle class” serves as a conve­niently amorphous concept that masks the exploitation and inequality of social relations. It is a class label that denies the actu­ality of class power.

    The C-word is allowable when applied to one other group, the desperate lot who live on the lowest rung of society, who get the least of everything while being regularly blamed for their own victimiza­tion: the “underclass.” References to the presumed deficiencies of underclass people are acceptable because they reinforce the existing social hierarchy and justify the unjust treatment accorded society’s most vulnerable elements.

    Seizing upon anything but class, leftists today have developed an array of identity groups centering around ethnic, gender, cultural, and life-style issues. These groups treat their respective grievances as something apart from class struggle, and have almost nothing to say about the increasingly harsh politico-economic class injustices perpe­trated against us all. Identity groups tend to emphasize their distinc­tiveness and their separateness from each other, thus fractionalizing the protest movement. To be sure, they have important contributions to make around issues that are particularly salient to them, issues often overlooked by others. But they also should not downplay their common interests, nor overlook the common class enemy they face. The forces that impose class injustice and economic exploitation are the same ones that propagate racism, sexism, militarism, ecological devastation, homophobia, xenophobia, and the like.

    source